Yet more managers escape!! (Nellies - The White Horse, Beverley)

[delboy]

Well surprise, surprise. I get in to my local last night (Nellies, Beverley) only to find that without warning to any regulars, the recently new managers have left. The pub has now set a new record for the town as having the largest turnover of management in the last two years, than any other pub in the town has had over the last 20! Locals in the town are now beginning to ask questions.. 

If all of these managers are/were in a union - all I can say is that the union must be totally useless and a complete waste of money - just jobs for the boys!?

Does anyone have any more info, regarding the latest management departures? It seems as if this is now happening every couple of months! 

[bothsides]

We were in Nellies today and what we heard was the newest Manager's left for the same old reason, it's impossible to run Nellies on the hours allocated.  Mr.Smith has been told this and although he has never actually worked in the pub, he's knows better!  The minimum hours required to run it properly is 215 (very conservative estimate), meaning the managers have to do a minimum of 135.  Would anyone else work below minimum wage complete with everything else that goes with it including the threat of losing your job and home at any minute?

Nellies is a fabulous pub with great customers and staff in a lovely town, selling good beer at a very reasonable price but it needs to be managed right and this takes time and skill.  He has had many skilled and dedicated Managers but he will not give them the hours needed. 

By the way the hours could be tripled and still be below the percentages most other companies allocate for staffing.  The hours allocation is not based on any business model, it appears to be a figure pulled from the air and bears no resemblance to turnover or GP.

Having said all of this, we know that there is no way to change his mind and unfortunately a jewel in the crown of Samuels Smiths is being run into the ground.  It's only a matter of time before something serious happens.

If serious changes ever took place, with the chance to run it as a business, I know of one management team who would be back in a shot.

[moleinahole]

I heard the same. They asked for some extra hours to employ staff, as they were working silly hours themselves - and it began to show. They seemed a very nice couple, and just like other management couples that have gone before them, tried hard to cope, until it began to wear them down.

Their request to Humphs was as usual not for debate. In my mind this proves that the man is either evil or insane. What other possible reason could you have for continually putting decent, hard working people through such misery. It's not much fun for the customers too, as with each change in management, the word gets round and previously banned trouble causers return, and we all have to watch the suffering as new managers try to do their best for a pittance.

Meanwhile loads of money has been spent on the place. A complete new kitchen which is no longer used, due to insufficient man hours to run it (that assuming your customers like ping pie). All the fire places are currently being refurbished to such an extent that the cost must be phenomenal. So hats off to Humph for his compassion for heritage (or is it just asset protection?), but sadly, people don't seem to matter with him whatsoever.

I heard that once Humphs turned down the request of the management couple, they then took their bond, packed up their belongings, left the keys on the bar and left the pub for good. We wish them all the very best - and at the same time warn others who may look at managing Nellies..

Don't for one moment think that all of the many management couples that have worked at Nellies, not been keen nor capable - with the current staff hour allocation - the place simply can not be run - unless a couple are prepared to work at least 14 hours a day - every day, for no no extra money (so getting less than the legal min. wage). And yet Humphs wants more. He wants up stairs open again (more customers and glasses to collect, etc.), and the kitchen open - totally impossible. The pub already relies on customer help with glass collection etc.

What a ridiculous state of affairs. Is it like this in any other Sams pubs?

[DarkieBoy]

What a ridiculous state of affairs. Is it like this in any other Sams pubs?

Unfortunately, it's like this in many of the Samuel Smith's urban pubs.

DB.

[OldBreweryDrinker]

I do know of a few others that seem to have a revolving door with managers. Surely this not the way to run a business. For the customer not knowing whether the pub is open or not and who is going to be running it.

[mac33]

What i find strange is that none of this ever gets reported in the press, there is a big story here for a dedicated newshound, or is it just that no newspaper will take the hump on.

[ian]

A mate of mine went in today and he tell's me that the ex managers of the Ruby in Hull  (left on good terms with Sam's)  is doing the relief at Nellies.

ian.

[garybaldy72uk]

Im sure Humph could be done under employment law Correct me if im Wrong But no one is allowed to work more than 48 hours a week a Ruling was passed recently!!!

He hasnt got a Leg to stand on!! .... surely theres a government department who should be looking into this and Fining The Arse of the SOB!!!!

[ian]

The Arse of the SOB!!!!

garybaldy we do try to keep some kind of etiquette on here, and by calling someone's mother a bitch is a little over the top. Can I suggest that you delete the remark please.

ian.

[garybaldy72uk]

Ok Hows about they just Lock Humph Up and throw away the key .......

By the SOB was Sad Old B*****D!  ..... I do have some ettiqutte as it goes i stick me Pinky out when drinking me Pint of OB!!

Im suprised youd rather attack me than say well done for mentioning The Law!!!

[ian]

Ok Hows about they just Lock Humph Up and throw away the key .......

By the SOB was Sad Old B*****D!

Im suprised youd rather attack me than say well done

I don't think I am attacking you.  But I believe you have to keep to some standards on here.  I will mention anything that I think is going too far. Just like I did when a poster started to name call a gay member of this forum.

Maybe we just live our life's by different  standards.


Re hour's worked. I think your find that some jobs do not come under that employment law.

ian.

[garybaldy72uk]

Must be something here that Humph is breaking on any given day! Like i say a call to the Right department might get someone to look at the situation its crazy!!

http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/your_money/employment/basic_rights_at_work.htm

Whistle-blowing at work

There is some protection for workers who are concerned about malpractice at work and who publicly disclose information about their employer’s activities. This is called ‘whistle-blowing’. The information disclosed must relate to:-

    a criminal offence
    a failure to comply with a legal obligation



    a health and safety issue
    damage to the environment
    an attempt cover up any of the above.

Further information and help with cases of public disclosure is available from:-

Public Concern at work
3rd Floor, Bank Chambers
6 - 10 Borough High Street
London
SE1 9QQ
Tel (general enquiries and helpline): 020 7404 6609
Fax: 020 7404 6576
E-mail (enquiries): whistle@pcaw.co.uk
E-mail (helpline): helpline@pcaw.co.uk
Website: (New window) www.pcaw.co.uk

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/WorkingHoursAndTimeOff/DG_10029426

[pintplease]

The Working Time Regulations do state that in general a worker should work no more than 48 hours in a week averaged over 17 weeks. The regulations allow workers to choose to opt out of the 48 hour limit and I am sure some employers will readily invite workers to do so.

It depends so much on the wording of the contract especially in the case of workers who live on the premises ie  are they on call 24 hour and if so are the hours when they are not working but on call classed as working hours ?

Transport workers and Junior Doctors were initially excluded from the provisions but are now covered. Some categories not covered are senior managers and others whose working time is not predetermined and who can exercise control over it.

Like all regulations there can be complications. If its such a problem the Managers should take collective advice.

[minsterman]

I dropped by Nellies at around 10pm last night (Friday) and it was the quietest Friday night I've ever seen in the place in over 30 years!!! There were only two people at the bar being served. There was also a main room sealed off with polythene, apparently part of ongoing fireplace restoration. One local commented it's like a permanent building site - not very welcoming.

I did ask the question to a few regulars - "where is everyone?". And the answers I got..

"across the road", and "people got fed up with waiting to get served over the last few months"

Just shows how daft Humphs is. 1) He believes punters will wait as long as it takes. and 2) his low prices will attract plenty of business. Wrong and, wrong!!!

I then went across the road to the Corner House (freehouse) pub, which was heaving!!! Their prices are much, much more expensive, but despite being very full, there were plenty of bar staff to serve customers. I got served in under two minutes!! If Nellies had been that full (like it used to be a few years ago) it would probably take 15-20 minutes to get served with today's staff shortage, assuming someone had been able to restock the glasses on the shelves - something which on my last visit, was having to be done by volunteers. Interesting to now see those same 'volunteers' all drinking in the Corner House, along with many other ex Nellies regulars.

Verdict.. Humphs must be making a fraction at that place from what he used to. He's killing his own business due to his stubbornness, incompetence, inexperience, and ignorance!!! A much better atmosphere and service (no disrespect to Nellies staff and management who are clearly trying their best is such adversities) at the Corner House - just 30 seconds walk from Nellies.

[whizz]

Regarding managers, I would have thought that the high turnover rate would in the end, self regulate, IE, run out of people willing to take the job on. Surely the word must have gone round the pub trade that it's a hard job running a Sams pub, so why do these people apply, why dont they apply to some other brewery?.